ANNOUNCER: What did Samuel mean when he said, God would make Saul a new man? Was Saul ever regenerated? Will he be in the kingdom someday? If you’re only looking at his actions, you may have doubts, but stay with us for an interesting discussion about this straight ahead. Thank you, friend, for joining us each day on Grace and Focus. Glad to have you with us today. This is a ministry of the Grace Evangelical Society. You can find us at faithalone.org. We have a magazine it is also called Grace and Focus. It is a full-length magazine, full-color, great presentation, great articles, and we want you to have it for free. Free means free, all except if you live outside of the 48 contiguous United States, you do need to pay the postage. Other than that, free, we do want you to have it. Get signed up for it today at faithalone.org. That’s faithalone.org. 

Now then with today’s question and answer discussion here are Bob Wilkin and Philippe Sterling. 

BOB: Welcome to Grace and Focus. I’m here with Pastor Philippe Sterling. Philippe it’s good to have you back. 

PHILIPPE: Well, it’s good to be back. It’s been a little while, hasn’t it? 

BOB: Yes, it has been a while, but not for you and I getting together. Well, every week at church, since you’re my pastor, but on top of that, we also get together every Friday with Ken Yates, because we’re kind of a troika.   that word, troika? 

PHILIPPE: Troika? It sounds like for three. 

BOB: Yes, it is. It’s a Russian loan word and it referred to a cart that was pulled by three oxen or three horses or whatever. And that’s called a troika. And so Art Farstad, Zane Hodges and I used to have lunch once a month and Art called them our troika meetings. We were three oxen. 

Anyway, you and I and Ken meet every Friday to discuss our Old Testament commentary. We just finished volume one, which was the Torah from the Tanakh, the T stands for the Law, or the first five books of the Old Testament. And now we’re working on volume two, which is the N in Tanakh, which is-

PHILIPPE: The Nevi’im, the prophets. 

BOB: And the prophets include some books you wouldn’t normally think of, like 1 and 2 Samuel, 1 and 2 Kings. 

PHILIPPE: But it’s normally divided as the former prophets and the latter prophets and the former prophets would be historical books, Joshua and Judges,1 and 2 Samuel, 1 and 2 Kings. And then the latter prophets would be the major prophets, the minor prophets.

BOB: All but Daniel, Daniel doesn’t get in there. Daniel goes in the writings. And the third part in the Tanakh is the K, the Ketuvim. And that will be volume three. Now we hope to have volume two out by May of 2027 for our annual conference. And we’re working hard. Basically we hope to have it, they’re all written except for the finishing editing is being done on Isaiah and Ezekiel. But as soon as that’s done, we hope to have everything done by the end of December. And then we’ll have a month or so for final proofing and typesetting and that sort of thing. And hopefully we’ll have it in print a month before the conference. 

But in any regard, Philippe and I are going to be talking about some of the work that you wrote the commentary right on, 1 and 2 Samuel. 

PHILIPPE: Yes, and that’s the first commentary that I wrote when we started the process, four years ago. And so this is kind of a review for me. It’s been a couple of years that I actually worked to it all, but now in the process of editing. 

BOB: Now in the Hebrew, it’s actually Samuel, right? There’s no 1 and 2. It’s just Samuel. 

PHILIPPE: Right. The Hebrew, it’s Samuel and well, it’s just Samuel and King. So it’s usually, in the Septuagint, it’s called Kingdom One, Kingdom Two, Kingdom Three, Kingdom Four. So 1 and 2 Samuel, 1 and 2 Kings. 1 and 2 Chronicles certainly focuses on the Judean kings and it’s a probably a post-exilic work. 

BOB: Post-exilic means after the exile. 

PHILIPPE: After the exile, and Ezra might actually be the one that’s the author of 1 and 2 Chronicles, but he reviews the history of the nation and to encourage the exiles who will return back to faithfulness.

BOB: Right. And Samuel was probably written by a mix of people, 1 and 2 Samuel. Samuel wrote some of it. 

PHILIPPE: Yeah, he would have been the early portions of Samuel, I think, certainly concerning his life and the narrative concerning him and Saul together, but then he died. So he couldn’t have written 2 Samuel. 

BOB: And so who probably wrote it? 

PHILIPPE: And so I think the best view is that the prophets Nathan and Gad might have been at least the final editors, the writers and final editors 1 and 2 Samuel and perhaps drawing on on the written work of Samuel. 

BOB: Is this the same Nathan that confronts David in 2 Samuel? 

PHILIPPE: Yes, 2 Samuel 11 and 12, 

BOB: And Nathan means, Natan is “to give.” And so Nathan is something like the Lord gives or something, because it’s Nathaniel. So in 1 Samuel chapter 10, around verses five through nine, there’s this interesting discussion about Saul. Could you read the key verses there, maybe the whole section or just verses six and nine, but it talks about Saul getting a new heart and becoming another man. And these are prophetic words by Samuel. 

PHILIPPE: Yes. This might be one of the few cases that we have of someone actually coming to believe and to be regenerated. It could be a good, clear, Old Testament example. 

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PHILIPPE: I mean, it would be a good, clear, Old Testament example. 

BOB: Yeah, there are lots of people in the Old Testament that did, but this is one that actually says, although it doesn’t use the word everlasting life, it’s pretty clear it’s here. So read those verses if you would. 

PHILIPPE: So Samuel has met up with Saul and God had just providentially Saul going trying to find his uncle’s donkey and God providentially brings him to Samuel. And the nation had demanded for a King prematurely, but Saul is God’s choice for that premature provision of a king So he instructs Samuel saying, I’m going to bring him to you and you will anoint him. And so they meet up and Samuel has a special meal with him. 

And then beginning with verse six, 1 Samuel chapter 10, I’ll actually begin with verse four. He says you’re going to meet a group of people, and a group of prophets and beginning at verse four, “And they will greet you and give you two loaves of bread, which you shall receive from their hands. After that, you shall come to the hill of God where the Philistine garrison is. And it will happen, when you have come there to the city that you will meet a group of prophets coming down from the high place, with a stringed instrument, a tambourine, a flute, and a harp before them; and they will be prophesying. Then the Spirit of the Lord will come upon you and you will prophesy with them,” and here’s a key expression, “and be turned into another man. And let it be, when these signs come to you, that you do as the occasion demands; for God is with you. You shall go down before me to Gilgal; and surely I will come down to you to offer burnt offerings and make sacrifices of peace offerings. Seven days you shall wait, till I come to you and show you what you should do.” And in the verse nine-

BOB: Unfortunately, he doesn’t wait quite long enough. 

PHILIPPE: He offers sacrifices himself instead of waiting for Samuel. But then though on that occasion, “So it was when he had turned his back to go from Samuel, that God gave him another heart and all these signs came to pass that day. When they came there to the hill, there was a group of prophets to meet him; then the Spirit of God came upon him and he prophesied among them. And it happened, when all who knew him formerly saw that he indeed prophesied among the prophets that the people said to one another, ‘What is this that has come upon the son of Kish? Is Saul also among the prophets?’ “ 

BOB: We had an article we published by Zane Hodges on Saul’s regeneration in 1994. And we republished it in 2011. You can see it at faithalone.org. Here’s what he says: “It would be pointless to quibble over the meaning of the statements I have italicized in verses six and nine.” And he’s talking about, “I will make you another man,” “I will give you a new heart.” And he said, “Surely they can refer to nothing other than new birth. How else can a sinner be turned into another man or given another heart than by regeneration? Clearly Saul was saved on that day!” And he goes on to say that these prophets must have been prophesying about the Messiah. 

PHILIPPE: Sure, they had musical instruments to wear singing, praising. And I think we have examples of what they might have been singing and praising in the book of Psalms. Several of the Psalms are clearly Messianic. And so they were just quoting from Genesis 3:15 or Genesis 15:6 and others about the seed promise and the Messiah who will come and deal with death and sin and where those who believed him, established his kingdom to rule over all. And Saul is going to be the first actual king, anointed to rule. 

BOB:And so this new heart, hear refers to the inner person, he has a new belief. And that new belief is that by faith in this coming one, the Messiah, he is going to be in that kingdom forever. He has an eternal relationship with Messiah. And I think he’s right. It’s pretty clear. Saul doesn’t end so well, he, just a week later, when he’s supposed to be waiting, he doesn’t wait long enough. And then when he’s supposed to kill,

PHILIPPE: All the Amalakites. 

BOB: Including the king, including all the animals, instead he saves the animals. And he allows the king to live and all that grieves God. And ultimately he doesn’t end so well, but what’s interesting is the man does appear to maintain faith until the very end. The reason he goes to the witch at Endor and calls up Samuel is because God has stopped talking to him. 

PHILIPPE: Right. Like you said, he did degenerate and he remained regenerate, but he did degenerate in his walk. 

BOB: In other words, he backslid. 

PHILIPPE: He backslid. Yes. but he has everlasting life, we’ll see him in the kingdom. We don’t know if he’ll have any aspect of rulership, we don’t know. He might. 

BOB: Well, I think this is real helpful and I encourage all of you to study 1 Samuel chapter 10 and Saul in his regeneration because I agree with Philippe. This is one of the clearest passages on regeneration in the Old Testament. 

Next time we’ll take a look at Saul’s backsliding, his degeneration, not loss of eternal life, but his falling from faithfulness. And in the meantime, let’s all keep grace in focus.

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On our next episode: what can we learn from King Saul’s life and backsliding. We hope you’ll join us again and, in the meantime, keep grace in focus.