ANNOUNCER: Why do some teachers not teach or preach from the Old Testament? What would it be like to have only the New Testament and not the Old Testament? Why is it so important to understand the Old Testament? Stay tuned, we’ll talk about it today here on Grace in Focus. In fact, all this week on Grace and Focus, talking about the Old Testament, and we are glad to have you with us, friend. This is a ministry of the Grace Evangelical Society. Our website is faithalone.org. And a couple of things of high interest there right now. The regional conference, July 19th through 23rd in Kamaiah, Idaho. Check that out, good information at faithalone.org/events. And our online seminary, Grace Evangelical Theological Seminary. We are in an open window here for applications and registration. Get ready to study with us in the fall. You can earn an MDiv degree. And full scholarships are available because of our generous donors. We thank them for that. Get information you need at faithalone.org/seminary. 

And now with the introduction to this week’s series about the Old Testament, here’s Bob Wilkin, along with David Renfro. 

BOB: David majored in Old Testament at Dallas Seminary and graduated almost 50 years ago. 

DAVID: Oh, thanks for sharing that. 

BOB: Didn’t you got your Master of theology in 78? 

DAVID: 78. 

BOB: That was the year I started, whippersnapper. 

DAVID: Yeah, you respect your elders, young man. 

BOB: So that’s 48 years ago. 

DAVID: That’s amazing. 

BOB: That is amazing. 

DAVID: It doesn’t feel that long since I went to the, I went to my 40th reunion from seminar. It doesn’t feel like it was that long ago and now look. 

BOB: I know, right? And now I keep track of age by 25 year increments. So I’m two and then soon I’ll turn three. 

DAVID: Well, being a computer nerd, it sounds a lot better if you use the base 16 thing that computers use. I love it because it sounds so much younger. 

BOB: You’re not even five yet. David loves the Old Testament. He considers himself an Old Testament specialist. Although you do preach in the New Testament. In fact, you’re currently at Victor Street preaching through what, 1 John? 

DAVID: I’m in 1 John. 

BOB: And you just finished what 1 and 2 Peter? 

DAVID: Right, the elders wanted me to go through the general epistles, which means I finished 1 and 2 Peter in 1 John and finished the other two letters of John and then go to what I consider holy ground, the book of Hebrews. 

BOB: There you go. 

DAVID: But it’ll be fun to do that. It is a break from the Old Testament, but I love the Old Testament. 

BOB: Well, and the book of Hebrews has so many quotes from the Old Testament, it’s almost like being in the Old Testament. 

DAVID: I’ll probably feel really at home. 

BOB: So I’ve got over the years, David. I have been asked so many questions about the Old Testament. I mean, lots and lots of questions over the years. And since I knew you were going to be here today, I have taken some of the very best questions I’ve been asked, and I want to just throw them at you and see what you have to say. 

DAVID: See if I can catch. 

BOB: Yeah, I see if you can catch. And I think you will enjoy this. And I think you all listening will enjoy this as well, because the Old Testament, as you know, David, like the Gospels, is much ignored in most churches today, right? 

DAVID: I forgot what Pastor said this, but it was very public. He said that I will never teach from the Old Testament ever again. And I just wanted to, if I had the authority, I would have said, hey, man, come here, you and I got to talk. 

BOB: The thing is, lots of churches, even quote-unquote Bible churches, almost exclusively teach from the New Testament epistles. They rarely teach from the Gospels. They rarely teach from the book of Revelation. And they almost never teach from the Old Testament. 

DAVID: I’ve even heard of churches and I’m talking to Bible churches that will not allow Sunday school teachers to teach Bible prophecy. And I’m going, what planet are they from? You know, I mean, that’s so important to even us as, you know, Bible-believing Christians here and now that’s a whole hope, of the literature of hope. Right, you know, and it just, it bothers me what’s going on in some churches. 

BOB: All right, so here’s my first question. This is one I’ve heard a lot. Why is it important to understand the Old Testament? Why is it important for New Testament believers who don’t live under the law of Moses, who don’t live during the time of the patriarchs, who live under the teachings of Christ and the apostles and the New Testament, why don’t we just ignore the Old Testament and teach the books that are written for us instead of books that were written for somebody else? 

DAVID: What I do is I summarize my thing, in saying this, I don’t think you can understand the New Testament to its fullest unless you have a very good understanding of the Old. 

BOB: Amen, absolutely. And don’t you think that works both ways? You really can’t understand the Old Testament fully without the New Testament shedding light on it. 

DAVID: One of the words that’s coming through to me a lot, when I’m speaking and all that stuff, is the word perspective. What the New Testament does is it gives us a perspective on what the Old Testament teaches from Jesus’ standpoint when He was teaching and now Paul and the other New Testament writers. But there’s a lot of stuff in the New Testament that we would just be clueless about if we didn’t have Old Testament references for that. 

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BOB: We need the Old Testament books on prophecy. I’m thinking especially of Daniel, which is important, but Isaiah and Jeremiah and Ezekiel and all of the minor prophets.

DAVID: Don’t forget Zechariah. 

BOB: Zechariah, all of these prophets, they tell us about the day of the Lord, they tell us about the time of Jacob’s trouble, the Tribulation period, Daniel tells us about his 70 weeks. You’ve got all this and without the teaching of the Old Testament, the book of Revelation wouldn’t make as much sense, and the Olivet Discourse wouldn’t make as much sense. We get lots of insights into the New Testament from understanding the Old Testament, and it’s not just prophecy, wisdom, literature too, right? 

DAVID: One of my classmates that seminary wrote his thesis on the Book of James being the wisdom book of the New Testament. 

BOB: And that’s really true. 

DAVID: And it’s really true. How would you know that if you didn’t know the Book of Proverbs and the other books of wisdom in the Old Testament? 

BOB: Yeah. And people say that the sermon in the mount was wisdom literature too. It is. Matthew 5, 6, and 7 is wisdom literature, and all of the book of James is wisdom literature. Well, if you haven’t studied Psalms and Proverbs and Ecclesiastes and Song of Solomon, well, 

DAVID: Don’t forget Job.

BOB: And Job, you’re right, because he says, I know my redeemer lives and I will stand with him in my flesh on the earth. That’s one of the key verses that shows it. What is that? Job 19:25, I think. 

DAVID: Something like that, yeah. 

BOB: And it shows that Old Testament believers did know about the fact that there was going to be bodily resurrection. There was going to be a kingdom. They would be living with Messiah. And Job may have been, do you think it was the first Old Testament book? I mean, it could have been around the time of Abraham, around 2000 BC. 

DAVID: One thing I did learn is that the style of Hebrew in Job is very ancient. It’s more ancient than a lot of the other, even old books, you know, the books of Moses, you know, that 

BOB: Around 1440 BC. 

DAVID: Yeah. And this is even older. So we don’t know, but the style of Hebrew, the words used, one of my profs said, there’s words in the book of Job that the old King James translators, they just literally guessed at the meaning. Because it was only used once in the whole Old Testament and they was in that diverse and Job. And so they just all they could do is guess. 

BOB: The Old Testament sheds light on wisdom literature. It sheds light on prophecy. It sheds light on creation. It also sheds light on the whole blessing and cursing motif, which is found all through the Old Testament. It’s found in the New Testament too, but a lot of people say, well, the God of the Old Testament was this God of wrath, but the God of the New Testament is the God of love. Those people haven’t read either Testament.

DAVID: Oh, that’s where I would come in and do my very eloquent, [buzzer sound].

BOB: Thank you for playing with me. Thank you for supporting me. 

DAVID: That’s right. 

BOB: That’s good. Because their God’s wrath is revealed in the New Testament as well. And God’s love and grace is revealed all through the Old Testament. 

DAVID: And also when is God’s wrath expressed? When the people are in gross disobedience to His law. 

BOB: And that was true in the Old Testament, but it’s also true for example in 1 Corinthians 11:30, “Because of this, some of you are sick and some sleep,” or you’ve got Ananais and Sapphira in Acts chapter 5 and they drop dead. And of course Romans talks about the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and all who suppress the truth in unrighteousness. And you know, the book of Revelation tells us about seven years of tribulation, which is going to be the pouring out of God’s wrath.

And so the Old Testament, it seems to me, opens the door to the New Testament. For example, Genesis 1, 2, and 3, I think are parallel in some ways to Revelation 20, 21, and 22. 

DAVID: Well, you have the creation in Genesis, the new creation in Revelation. 

BOB: Yeah, “I saw a new heaven and new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away.

DAVID: Yeah, like I like to say about that. What the Lord’s not going to do, this is not a, He’s not going to remodel the current universe. It’s a tear down and rebuild, and by that’s what it is. 

BOB: Yeah, some people say that when 2 Peter 3 talks about this great fiery burning, or Jesus said, heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away, they say what that means, it’s kind of a renewal, but not a total destruction. I agree with you. I think it’s going to be a cataclysmic elimination of what we have. So every stain of sin is gone. And we’re going to get new planets, new stars. We’re going to get a new sun, a new moon, a new earth. And this is going to be a universe in which righteousness dwells. 

DAVID: Well, even in Genesis 1, when it says in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, that’s a merism, meaning using opposites to indicate totality. 

BOB: He created everything. 

DAVID: He created everything. And so what do you think when Revelation says and he created a new heavens and a new earth? He created a new everything. So to me, the style and I think it’s a valid to put that in Revelation. I think it’s clear in the Old Testament, but it needs to be applied in Revelation the same way. 

BOB: Very good. All right. Well, David, next time I want you to think about this, we’re going to talk about your favorite five Old Testament books. And my favorite five Old Testament books, I want you to jot down your favorite five Old Testament books and see if you sync up with David and me. And in the meantime, what are we going to do? Keep grace in focus. 

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On our next episode: five favorite Old Testament books. Be sure to join us. In the meantime, let’s keep grace in focus.