Transcript

ANNOUNCER: The Book of Romans. What is it all about and to whom is it written? Is the wrath of God in Romans about the lake of fire? Or is it a wrath that is being experienced here and now? Glad you have joined us today, friend, here on Grace in Focus. This is a ministry of the Grace Evangelical Society. Our website is faithalone.org where you can get details about our online seminary, a place where you can earn an MDiv degree. Get all the details, go through the application process, get ready to study with us next semester. And we also invite you to our national annual conference, May 18th through the 21st. Find out what you need to know to get registered at faithalone.org. 

And now with today’s question and answer discussion, here’s Bob Wilkin, along with Ken Yates. 

KEN: We’re doing a series on different sessions that we’re hoping to do for our national conference May 18th through 21st. One of the sessions we’re going to be dealing with is the Book of Romans. And the question is, is the Book of Romans talking about believers being delivered from God’s wrath? 

BOB: Which is the common view. And Luther famously said that his understanding of Romans 1:16-17 led him to believe that justification is by faith alone apart from works.

KEN: Now, when you say it is the common view, you’re meaning that it is evangelistic then, right? Because that’s the common view, right? That believers are delivered from the wrath of hell. 

BOB: Yes, I think the common view, that is what you would find in most commentaries and what you would find in most pulpits when they preach through Romans, is that Romans is reminding, it’s written to believers. Most people will say that, but they’ll say its purpose is to remind believers that we were justified by faith apart from works. 

KEN: So it’s talking to believers and basically says, you know, you ought to be grateful for what God has done for you already. 

BOB: Well, there is the question, what is it that’s the application of the book? In other words, how do I apply that? Is it gratitude? Is it, you know, that I’m going to be sharing this message with others? Is Romans wanting me to, the application is tell others about justification by faith alone? Even though I’m already born again, if someone’s not born again, then am I supposed to share this gospel, which Romans 1:16-17 talks about with unbelievers so that they might have justification, which there is a section in the book of Romans chapters 3:21 to 4:24 or 4:25, depending on how you see it, that does deal with justification. 

But the question is, is that what the book’s about? Maybe we could take a look at Romans 1:16-17 and talk about that because Zane Hodges has a radically different view, right? 

KEN: What wrath means here? Again, the common view is that wrath is looking toward the future wrath in the lake of fire, right? That would be the most common view. 

BOB: And so then what we need to be delivered from is the eternal wrath of God in the lake of fire. Hodges, however, argues, by the way, that God’s wrath is always in time and that the lake of fire is justice. It’s not wrath. God is not eternally angry. God’s wrath ends with the end of the Millennium and putting down the rebellion at the end of the Millennium and that people are not experiencing God’s wrath forever, that what they’re experiencing is justice. 

And so God looks at the deeds. Remember, in Galatians, Paul says, “Do not be deceived, God it not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap.” Well, that’s true of believers, but it’s also true of unbelievers. Jesus said He’s coming “in the glory of His Father with His angels and then He will recompense each according to his works,” which is in that context dealing with believers, but it’s a general statement that also applies to unbelievers. 

KEN: I just want to say before we go further into this, I was just this past weekend, I was in a Sunday school class and they were talking about Romans 9 and 10. And in this class, they took the view, that in Romans 9 and 10, Paul’s talking about Israel. Right. But what they said was Romans 9 and 10 when it’s talking about Israel, it’s really talking about the church and that it’s all salvation from hell. Every bit of it, later will all Israel be saved. It’s just talking about all the elect, anyone who repents of their sins, they need to be saved from the wrath of the lake of fire. That’s what the whole class was. So that’s what Bob and I are discussing. Is that what the book is talking about? 

BOB: And I would say no, and I would like to challenge each of you, if you’ve not heard the idea that Romans is really about deliverance from wrath here and now, and it’s believers being delivered from wrath. By the way, Hodges wants to call it delivered rather than saved because he thinks when people hear saved, they think the wrong idea. 

KEN: The first time I went on a trip to teach for GES, I went to the Philippines and I was asked to teach the book of Romans. And Zane’s book had just come out and I used it as the textbook. I took Zane’s view that it’s delivered from temporal wrath here now. When I was done, they called me in and they said, you know, your view is a minority view and we don’t want you back. So this goes against the grain of the common view, as people see the lake of fire here. And I’m glad that Zane uses the word deliverance versus save because of that confusion. 

BOB: That’s the subtitle of his commentary, deliverance from wrath. 

KEN: Right, deliverance instead of salvation, right. Okay. So in Romans 1:16-17, Martin Luther and most people would agree that this is the theme of the book, that this is what the book is about. And we would expect to find it, it’s not surprising that we would find it at the beginning of the book. 

BOB: In letters you tend to find the purpose at the beginning, in gospels like the Gospel of John, you find it at the end, right. 

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BOB: I would agree this is the theme, but let’s understand it correctly. So what does he say here? 

KEN: Paul says, “For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation, for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written,” in the New King James, it says, “the just shall live by faith,” and Zane in his commentary points out that really that should say, “he who is righteous by faith shall live.” 

BOB: And the “shall live” he understands is essentially having imperitival force that they “should” live and he sees this as a reference to Romans 5 through 8. 

KEN: The live part. 

BOB: Yeah, the sanctification section. Now notice here what it starts out with. This is an example of litotes or understatement. When Paul says, “I am not ashamed of the gospel,” what he means is I’m proud of it. 

KEN: I want to proclaim it. 

BOB: I want to proclaim it. But now when a lot of people see the gospel, they think saving message, but what he’s talking about is this good news message. By the way, notice he said it in verse 15 also. What does 15 say? 

KEN: He goes, “I am ready to preach the gospel to you who are in Rome also.” 

BOB: Okay. No, wait a minute. If he’s writing to believers in Rome and we have lots of examples in the book that shows he’s writing to born again people, right? Well, then why does he want to preach the gospel to them if the gospel is the saving message? 

KEN: And what people will say is, well, he wants to go to Rome because there’s other unbelievers there. 

BOB: And actually, Hodges in his commentary hadn’t quite thought this through yet and he died before he finished it. He was in the middle of chapter 14. And I actually wrote the commentary on the end of 14, 15, and 16. And John Niemela and I wrote notes, but Hodges said that he’s thinking here of others in Rome, like you just said, that would be unbelievers. But no, that’s wrong. He’s wanting to preach the message in 16 and 17, which Hodges takes as a sanctification message. 

How would it be a sanctification message? “I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes.” Isn’t he saying that the gospel is the power of God for the believer— 

KEN: to be saved from wrath. 

BOB: Right. He’s not saying, the way a lot of people take it, that if you believe, then you are saved. 

KEN: From the lake of fire, right? 

BOB: He’s saying, if you believe, then you can be saved. 

KEN: Right. There’s this power that is available to you to the one who believes there is this power that is available to you, as you said a minute ago, Romans chapter 5, 6, 7, and 8 as we walk by the Spirit, the same power that raised Jesus from the dead lives within us. 

BOB: And notice how verse 18, which immediately follows this, says, “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness.” 

KEN: Note, it’s is revealed, not will be revealed. 

BOB: Yeah. And this goes all the way from 18 to the end of the chapter. Point is the believer can be saved from this wrath or delivered from this wrath by living. He goes on to say, the just by faith shall live. We’re justified by faith. And now we need to live the life in order to be delivered from the wrath. And so it’s a radically different way of seeing Romans. Ultimately what you’re saying is, Romans is a book about sanctification. 

KEN: It’s a book that is written to believers. 

BOB: It is true there’s a short section dealing with justification by faith alone. 

KEN: And I would say even there, Bob, and I know you agree with me, that even as discussion on justification is related to this, now that we have been declared righteous as believers, we have access to God. 

BOB: In fact, the very end of that section, Romans 4:25 is actually a sanctification verse. 

KEN: In Romans 4:25, it says that Jesus “was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.” 

BOB: But the word is not justification. That would be dikaiosune for righteousness. This is dikaiosin. 

KEN: Which is a different word, right? 

BOB: And it basically means righteous living. And so he’s basically saying He was raised so that we might live righteously which, by the way fits all of Paul’s epistles. For example, in Philippians 3, that we’re to live out the resurrection life of Christ. The power, the resurrection power of Christ is available to cause us to live righteously. 

We would encourage you to do some careful study of the book of Romans and consider that the book of Romans might well not be all about justification, but it’s really about sanctification and it’s about living righteously and being delivered from the wrath of God in this life. And that if you’re a believer in Christ, that doesn’t mean that you can live any old way. If you don’t live for Christ, if you don’t live righteously, then you’re going to experience God’s wrath in this life, even though you’re eternally secure.

KEN: Even though you’ll be in the kingdom. 

BOB: Even though you’ll be in the kingdom. 

KEN: Well, we hope that that whets your appetite for study in Romans more, and in the meantime, keep grace in focus. 

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On our next episode: is the Roman’s road evangelistic approach, valid? Please join us for that and until then, let’s keep grace in focus.