Transcript

ANNOUNCER: You’ll see Jeremiah 29:11 on lots of Christian merch these days. It says, “I know the plans I have for you, says the Lord.” Well you know the rest, but the question today is, how much does this apply to you and me? And what parts of Scripture can we, should we see as applicable in our experience today? It’ll be a great discussion, hope you’ll stay with us. This is Grace in Focus and it is a ministry of the Grace Evangelical Society. We have a website, faithalone.org. We’d like to invite you there and especially we’d love for you to go to our events section. Upcoming in May 18th through the 21st is our national conference. We want you to be there with us. It is at Camp Copass, just north of the DFW Metroplex, a great camp where we have this conference every year. This will be our ministry’s 40th year and we’ll celebrate that. Get all the details, get registered. Come and join us May 18th through the 21st. The website, faithalone.org/events. 

And now with today’s question and answer discussion, here are Ken Yates and Kathryn Wright. 

KEN: We got a great question from Cindy. So, Kathryn, why don’t you tell us what Cindy asks? 

KATHRYN: Yeah, sure. Cindy is, she’s teaching a ladies Bible study, which is awesome. We love to hear that. And this is based off of a question that she got from one of her Bible studies. They’ve been in Jer 29. The context there was very clearly towards the nation of Israel, which we’ll talk about here in a second. But then she asked about Philippians 4:6-7. Basically, a question came up in the class of why we could apply that passage to us, but not Jer 29. 

KEN: Okay, well, let’s look at, she’s talking about the context and how we apply passages. For example, if a passage is dealing with the nation of Israel in the context, is it legitimate then to say, well, that’s for us. Because as dispensationalists, we know that the Church is not the new Israel, that God made certain promises to Israel, and he didn’t make them to the Church. When you get into the New Testament, sometimes when in the New Testament, particularly in the Gospels, the teaching is directed toward the nation of Israel. 

KATHRYN: Or the disciples, I was just thinking it came to my mind when He instructs them to go to the world, go and preach and make disciples around the world. Was that applicable to us? What if you only live in one town your whole life? Have you disobeyed the Lord, you know? 

KEN: Yeah. And when He sends the seventy out, go to Israel. And when he sends the disciples out and says, don’t take any money, get extra set of clothes and stuff like that. Obviously. 

KATHRYN: Yeah, that might be, I’m going to Uganda in like a month and I’m taking some clothes and I’m taking some money with me. So am I disobeying the Lord? 

KEN: Well, like for example, when we get to Jer 29, in Jer 29, Jeremiah is talking about the Jews—

KATHRYN: In Babylon. 

KEN: In Babylon. And he says in chapter 29, for example, verse five, “build houses and dwell in them, plant gardens and eat their fruit.” 

KATHRYN: Talking about being in Babylon, after they’ve been taken into captivity by the Babylonians. 

KEN: Right. And the point there is that there were, the Jews who were saying, well, we’re not going to be here very long. God’s not going to destroy Jerusalem or the temple. And so we’re going to go back real quick. But God’s already said, nope, you’re going to be there 70 years. And so build houses, you’re going to be there awhile. So if you’re 30 years old and you go to Babylon, you’re going to die there. And that’s the point, right? Build your houses, get married, have kids. 

KATHRYN: And Cindy rightfully says we acknowledge that’s not for us. We’re not in Babylon. We’re not the nation of Israel. We’re not instructed to do those things. So she rightfully sees that and sees the distinction. 

KEN: Yeah, it would be, for example, if somebody says, well, I’d like to serve the Lord and yeah, okay, be a missionary or something. And they read this and go, wait a second, build my house, stay here. I’m not supposed to travel.  And so Cindy’s obviously right in this context, it’s talking about Israel, really Judah in this case, Judah. But in that context, it’s because God’s already told them. God’s told them, you’re going to be there. 

KATHRYN: And the reason they’re going to be there is because of the covenant that was already established with the Lord and the Israelites, right, that that if you obey me, I’ll bless you. But if you disobey me, I’m going to discipline you and there’s going to be a consequences. And so when you see the Babylonian captivity, that is part of the covenant toll relationship that the Lord has with the Jews. 

KEN: And so for those who did want to build their houses, they weren’t submitting to God’s Word. God’s Word said you’re going to be there for seven years. Folks were saying ,at least some folks, no, we’re going to, we’re going to be—

KATHRYN: I’m not unpacking my bags. I’m going to drag my feet and the Lord is saying, nope, you need to submit to this discipline. 

KEN: Right. And so we have this issue from Cindy. Well, how do we look at something and say, okay, like she mentions Phil 4, okay, can we say the same thing in Philippians 4 that wait a second, is Paul just talking to the Church at Philippi? Is this a promise just for the believers at Philippi? You know, and how do we, if we’re going to say that about Jeremiah, Jeremiah is for the nation of Israel. It’s addressed to the nation of Israel. Why don’t we do the same thing? And there’s a million examples in the New Testament, not a million, but a bunch of them. Well, what if he’s talking to a specific church? How do we, can we apply that and say, well, that’s for all believers? 

KATHRYN: Right. One example before we got on, we talked about when Paul tells Timothy, you know, he’s got stomach issues and he tells him to, to drink some wine. Is that applicable for all believers today for medicinal instructions all the time? And obviously not. Obviously, that was a specific instruction, a piece of advice, if you will.

KEN: Right. And we would say we have different medicinal practices today. So he’s specifically talking to Timothy. 

ANNOUNCER: We will rejoin in just a moment. But years ago, Zane Hodges wrote the Gospel Under Siege. Sadly, this is still true. And GES president Bob Wilkin has recently written its sequel. Bob’s new book, The Gospel is Still Under Siege, is a book about theological clarity on the Biblical teaching about eternal salvation. It is available now. Secure yours today at the Grace Evangelical Society’s bookstore. Find it at faithalone.org/store. That’s faithalone.org/store. Now back to today’s content.

KEN: And to be honest, sometimes it’s difficult. When it when is something applicable to all believers, when we read about it, the New Testament and when is it no, no, no, this is, and you just gave one example, you know, Paul with Timothy. 

KATHRYN: Or like what we gave earlier with the disciples in their ministry, which was unique, the instructions that the Lord gave them—that’s not for all believers today. 

KEN: And I would say, and I don’t know, Cindy would agree with this, or our listeners would, I’m sure there’s some who would not, but even the Great Commission. Is that for all believers? Or is that for the twelve? 

KATHRYN: We’re so we’re treading on thin ice here, but I would say it’s for the disciples for the apostles. 

KEN: Yeah, particularly in the gospel of Mark, Mark 16, when he says, “these signs will follow those who believe” and he lists them. That’s for the twelve who are going out. And so Cindy’s question is a good one. 

KATHRYN: It’s a great one. I do think you’ll hear people say, right, 2 Tim 3:16, that all Scripture is God breathed and it’s profitable. And so on one level, could we not say, even Jeremiah, that there are principles that we can take from that passage? Yes, we’re not called to go move to Babylon and start, you know, start a family and build a house or whatever, vineyards, but that we see principles that we can learn that when the Lord tells us things that we should obey it, even when it’s difficult. 

KEN: And that would be it, right? That is exactly what I was thinking. It’s profitable. What is it? Those Jews who were in Babylon, it was profitable for them to obey the Lord, go there. You’re going to live there. You’re going to die there. There it is. I’ve told you. Now you can waste your time and you can make your life miserable or you can go there and start a family. And by the way, those families, those are going to be the kind of people who can return to the land. But if you’re set there and go, look, I’m not going to get married, because we’re going to go back to the land here. You’re not going to do this. I’m not going to listen to God’s word here. Then, yeah, you’re cutting yourself off from the blessings of God here. And the children that you would have who would go back to the land and possess it and see the deliverance of the people from the land of Babylon.

But in the New Testament, for example, let’s look at the Philippians four, she mentioned especially Phil 4:6-7, is this just for the church at Philippi or is this for believers everywhere, “Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving, let your request be made known to God.” And here’s the promise—”and the peace of God which surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.” 

Well, when I come to a passage like that, what I would say is first of all, he’s talking to the church at Philippi. He’s not talking to the Jews. He’s talking to the church. And so this would be applicable for all churches, for all believers—

KATHRYN: In the church age. 

KEN: In the church age. Right. And we have, depending on how we interpret this passage, he’s telling us not to be anxious for anything. But as we go to the Lord in prayer with our request, giving thanks, making our request known to God, we’re going to experience, this is the promise, that we’re going to experience the peace of God in the sense that God is going to take care of this. And the point is, I’m making my request, but it’s with the understanding that I want God’s will to be done. And so this would be something that is applicable to all believers. 

KATHRYN: Would it be fair to say there’s a sense in which that’s true for even the Old Testament believers? If we could maybe talk about the Jeremiah folks again that they shouldn’t be anxious in that time either as they are praying to the Lord and looking for His guidance as well. Like, isn’t that true for any dispensation of believers? 

KEN: Yeah, you know, in our Sunday school classes morning, we were talking about the difference between believe and trust. Somebody brought up in the class that in the Psalms, it’s always trust, relying upon Him, relying upon Him. So as I’m making my request known to God, I shouldn’t be anxious because I’m going to Him. It reminds me of Peter, casting all your cares upon him for He cares about you. Right. And that results in peace because I know as I’m relying upon Him that He cares for me. That’s even making that statement there gives me a certain level of peace. You’re like, okay, He’s one that I can cast my cares. 

KATHRYN: Yeah. I guess the short answer is it just depends on the context. We have to look at these contexts within their individual meanings, but that certainly when we get into the epistles addressed to the Church, as we are still in the church age, then we can look at those instructions, those commandments, those “let us” statements that Bob always likes to talk about “the lettuce,” “let us” statements that those include us because we are still in the church age today. So therefore they’re applicable to us. 

KEN: Yeah. So obviously Philippians 4:67 definitely applicable for us today. Great question, Cindy. And remember, keep grace in focus. 

ANNOUNCER: Would you be interested in some free ebooks on topics you hear on this program? Well, if you are, you need to come visit us at faithalone.org. That’s faithalone.org. We would love to hear from you. Maybe you’ve got a question, comment, or some feedback. If you do, please don’t hesitate to send us a message. Here’s our email address. It’s radio at faithalone.org. That’s radio at faithalone.org. And when you do very important, please let us know your radio station call letters and the city of your location.

On our next episode: has Christ forgiven unbelievers? Come back and join us. And in the meantime, let’s keep grace in focus.